This Will Pack 'Em In!
Wednesday, February 7, 2007 at 02:01PM 
Looking for a way to pack people into your church? How about this? Porn and Pancakes!
According to an article on wcbstv (Click here: wcbstv.com - Upstate NY Church Hosts 'Porn And Pancakes' Event) . . .
"(AP) ONTARIO, N.Y. It's not your typical church breakfast.
An event billed as `Porn and Pancakes' is being hosted by a church in rural upstate New York. The breakfast discussion on the pornography industry in America is planned next month at the Living Word Assembly of God Church in the town of Ontario, in rural Wayne County about ten miles east of Rochester. A billboard advertisement near the church shows the words `Porn and Pancakes' written in syrup on a stack of flapjacks. Organizers said the Feb. 10 event will be an honest discussion about pornography and its impact on society. The discussion will be led by XXX Church, a group of youth ministers who travel the country talking about porn and the porn industry. The pastor of the Wayne County church said that churches from Buffalo, Rochester and Syracuse have asked about also hosting `Porn and Pancakes' events."
And you thought I was kidding . . . This one is so bad it is hard to say anything in reply. Before anyone has a cow, the picture comes from the wcbstv website reporting on the event.
Looks to me like a "bait and switch" operation of the first order. And just what will the pastor say to all the sweet little old ladies and curious teens and their angry parents in his church? I guess they just have to put up with this so the church can "reach out."
I give up . . .
Reader Comments (61)
No, "manu" doesn't mean... That. In fact, it really means nothing at all. I wanted a screename like "mattman" but that's pretty much taken everywhere I go, so I put "u" in with it. It sounds a bit like an east asian rendering of "mattman".
Some people have thought it's saying "Matt you man you"... What dirty minds. :P
As I expected, my situation was not unique. I can relate to every word you said. Even though I agree with most of the other comments made, it's sad my slight praise towards the XXX software has been the subject of intense criticism. So lets put aside the status of XXXchurch, which isn't a church quite frankly, and wouldn't want to be thought of as one either. Now let's move onto the real, dirty, and practical problem. As a young male growing up with internet temptations, unknown to the older folks out there (until recently), sexual immorality has never been easier. As a Christian who knows the doctrines of grace, belives the creeds, and takes the sacrament, giving into this tempation over and over again causes great distress and is simply spiritually exhausting. Certainly our problem is a deep seated sin-nature, which is true, but the individual sin acts drain the soul and are distressing beyond belief. I know. While to some, the solution may seem absurdly simple, carrying it out is another matter. I can offer you some practical advice, and the wise theological curmudgeons can counsel you with scripture and doctrine. Hopefully they won't be too flippant towards this serious problem. (note: for those who believe the solution is to behave like a man and grow up, you may wish to stop reading here) Also, for the record, looking at porn is an irrational behavior and that is why it make no sense. It is easy for those to jest at scars who never felt a wound.
I see no basis for insulting the notion of accountability partners, and if I can be convicted by scripture or plain reason that this belief is in error, I will take it back. Computer filters are bunk, because it becomes a game to see how you can get around them. Also, they usually cost money. Doing it on your own with a "lone ranger" attitude works for a week or two, and then it gives out. That's why I advocated the free software found on the forbidden website, which since the long time I've had it, I've stayed consistently away from that dirty stuff. Since then, God's been able to change my life in ways that had previously been impeded by the sin. I simply told a close friend that I thought it would be a good idea if we both installed the program, to keep us accountable, and there were no questions asked. No ifs ands or buts. Some may call this intent moralistic, but it has been immeasurably freeing for me. The tempation is gone, because I wouldn't want to look at something bad, knowing my friend would find out. I don't even entertain the thought anymore, it's a non-starter. Most of all, since this problem is driven by cultivating a sinful habit, cutting the action that leads to the habit is the way to destroy the habit itself. I thank God for the grace he has shown me through this incident, and acknowledge that he is the source of all the lasting change that has resulted in my life. I now rejoice with Paul, "forgetting what is behind and straining toward what is ahead," knowing that I am a new creation in Christ. I here you brother, and I will pray for you.
But to think that such groups exist and call themselves 'Christian' or 'church'...
...well, I thought I'd heard it all, but apparently not.
"My bad. False advertising is wrong. I just meant it's fine to advertise pancakes and porn (hahaha, how silly), and then hit 'em over the head with the Gospel."
sorry, i am still confused...how is that not false advertising?
zrim
Is it Luther's intention to just cease from fighting the sin, and then just trust in Christ's grace? It seems to me that you must continue to fight, while(!!) you are fighting the sin.
It seems to me that you must continue to fight, while(!!) you are trustin Christ.
"I can offer you some practical advice, and the wise theological curmudgeons can counsel you with scripture and doctrine"
With respect and sensitivity to your situations do you really think that the solution is not found in scripture? Scripture and doctrine are not practical?
How bout this for advice: "If you eye causes you to sin, pluck it out"
If the internet is causing you to sin, disconnect it. If TV is causing you to sin, turn it off during primetime. If the magizine rack is causing you to sin, buy your newspaper elswhere. If the woman/man next door is causing you to sin, avoider her/him at all cost.
I speak from experience when I say that the more time you spend reading the Bible and commentaries and such, and not watching TV and aimlessly searching the internet, the less you lust after flesh.
You will still struggle but you need to cut off the things that cause you to fall. Hanging out at a tavern is not a good practice for a recovering alcoholic.
But when you do sin you need to remember that you have an advocate with the Father.
And, my "accounability partner(s)" are found in my local church. I see them at least twice every week.
Therein lies the key.
What DOES "manfully" really mean?
My guess is it has something to do with Jesus Christ, as the Second Adam; THE man of men; his own accomplishments against temptation and understanding how he is restoring the Imago Dei in His fallen people.
????
really?
while i obviously question the validity of such things as baby-sitter software and accountability partners, i also wonder the implications here: i wonder about the idea that simply burying oneself in bible reading somehow helps one to sin less (?). each perosn has to make his own judgment call about where he puts himself given his situation (i.e. common sense). how many times has my own mind drifted whilst reading the bible/going to church/praying/etc.? plenty. i am also not so sure how wise it is to promote pious activities as mere distractors. plenty of things can distract one from sinful ways, can't they?
"If the internet is causing you to sin, disconnect it. If TV is causing you to sin, turn it off during primetime. If the magizine rack is causing you to sin, buy your newspaper elswhere. If the woman/man next door is causing you to sin, avoider her/him at all cost."
at what point is a line drawn? i mean, seems to me that you just can't get away from "things that cause you to sin," can you? i sense a monasterial impulse here: don't we end up holed up somewhere, deceiving ourselves that "we have finally manipulated our world to the point that we have made it impossible to sin"? when trying to make the case for a high view of sin and total depravity, i have always said that i could sit in a box all day, staring into the corner and humming to myself in order to keep bad thoughts away...but i still couldn't emerge from that box and say i was sinless that day! even if we delete actual sin we still have to contend with the reality of conditional sin.
jesus said if your eye causes you to sin, not some outside force, not if the magazine rack causes you to sin. seems to me jesus put sin in the lap of sinners, it is personal: YOU (your eye) causes you to sin, not the woman across the street, not the tv, not the internet, not the pub. YOU do.
zrim
"Wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death? Thanks be to God through Jesus Christ our Lord!"
Hmmm...How many eyeless and handless people do we see walking around? What was Jesus saying there? Perhaps that extreme measures should be taken to get rid of particular sins??? (I'm really asking). Not that we would come out of it sinless, but that we would recognize our sin, pursue holiness and pray for Spirit-wrought obedience(?)
Even literalists don't follow through on eye plucking. So how are we to "cut off" offending members? How do people "pluck out" the offending porn watching eyes?
And yep, lust won't quit just because one is isolated...or walks on the other side of the street to avoid triggers.
At the same time, should we just throw up our hands and say things like, "Well, I can't avoid television so Lord give me the strength to deal with those 'Deal or No Deal' models"? This is tough stuff.
I'm going to Alpha and Omega ministries blog where I won't even pass over ridiculous posts. Dr. Whites protest against posting on blogs may end up getting my support.
i am inclined to go back to something robin said above, as well as chris, with regard to your question. i wonder if we might say that, first, yes, jesus was saying that an extreme measure was called for but was perhaps similtaneously playing on the implied ridiculousness of handless and eyeless people literally hobbling around: sin must be dealt with extremely, thus His person and work on our behalf. sin must be confronted but if we are to do so on our own abilities it might look like a B-class horror flick, because that is how ridiculous the idea of us fixing it ourselves is. i wonder if His audience, upon hearing Him, thought secretly, "are You crazy? how is that an answer?" and He knew it and was allowing the real answer to surface: a greater treatment makes more sense. so instead of hobbling ourselves He was hobbled, as it were.
i also think of when He said, "If any man lusts after a woman he has already committed adultery with her." "if"? every man here knows darn well that it is a fact that he is an adulterer by the very virtue of being a man. not a one of us escapes this. sure as the sky is blue being a man equals being an adulterer. i don't think the point is, "work harder," but that the gospel has been wraught for you...now live like it, as feeble as that will be. so there's no throwing up of hands and hoping for more grace-as-magic to be poured out on us. rather, it's the gospel being announced, over and over and over, and the call to live as if that is true, live as one under grace. the imperative cannot be divorced from its indicative. onc eit is, all you have is moralism, which itself depends on human might alone.
what do you think?
zrim
you write what I was getting at.
Jesus raises the bar in the Sermon on the Mount. We are driven down by it, we realize that we cannot live up to it and we learn all the more to cling to the only truly righteous One.
zrim
i think in general we treat both our men and women in our culture and church like children. while i have no interest in the stuff of bootstrap morality and find all forms of it repugnant, i really must say that the subtle cries of the therapeutic and the stuff of victimhood are also no friends to our high views of sin and grace.
there are legitimate addictions (e.g. drug and alcohol addictions) and legit forms of therapy, i think. sometimes i think we over-do our calvinism, etc. to make a point and end up eradicating these legitmate things, to be honest. but men acting like little boys is in a different league. i realize many disagree with these views. that is fine.
zrim