Monday
Apr232007
Who Said That?
Monday, April 23, 2007 at 11:14AM 
Who said that?
Our faith, from our ancestors, which we have learned also from you, is this. We know one God--alone unbegotten; alone everlasting, alone without beginning, alone true, alone possessing immortality, alone wise, alone good, alone master, judge of all, manager, director, immutable and unchangeable, just and good, God of Law, Prophets and New Testament--who begat an only begotten Son before eternal times, through whom he made the ages and everything."
Leave your guess in the comments section below! No google searches!
Update on Monday, April 30, 2007 at 11:26AM by
Kim Riddlebarger
Kim Riddlebarger
As some of you guessed, these words come from the arch-heretic Arius (in his letter to Alexander of Alexandria). Sneaky heretic that he was, Arius goes on to define his earlier statement "begotten before eternal times" to mean, "he [the Son] was created by the will of God before times and ages."
Reader Comments (29)
Really?
zrim
No clue.
So this must be someone with a low view of Christ. This must be someone who thought of the Son of God as the Greeks used to think of Achilles as the son of a goddess, or Heracles (or Hercules for you Latin types) the son of Hera.
Apparently this person thinks very low of Christ, but then gets confused saying that Christ was begotten before eternal times.
So he starts with a low view of Christ, but then qualifies that, as if to say, "But I don't have a low view of Christ, he was from the beginning and is our Creator."
This is someone who is a little confused on the nature of the Trinity, or at least lacks a little care in how they phrase things.
At best you can say that this statement is theologically sloppy, at worst you can say it's out and out heretical. Is Jesus God or not? This quote doesn't really make that clear.
What on earth is "before eternal times" supposed to mean? What would eternal time be? Is there a special time in which Christ begins, but the universe had not yet begun? It seems like this person thinks that Christ was just created before the universe was. Christ was sort of a super-special angel. He is God's second in command, but he is not himself God, because there's only ONE God, and he is not begotten.
This person doesn't seem to distinguish God in his essence from God in his Three Persons. He knows of no God the Father, but only of God in himself, which the Son and apparently the Spirit are not cosubstantial with.
We believe Christ is eternally begotten, and who has no beginning. He is not created, he is God. God the Father, God the Son and God the Spirit are the One True God. God subsists in Three Persons, but we don't worship three gods. We worship one God.
This person doesn't get that. Maybe he's just wrestling with it or whatever, but he doesn't seem to believe in the Creed, or at least doesn't understand it well enough to reflect it in his thinking.
Let's give him a good flogging and be done with it.
Echo_ohcE
don't be so platonic(!)...c'mon, name a name! :)
zrim