More Friends With "Issues"

Here are interviews with two friends who have both recently appeared on "Issues, Etc." which may be of interest to you.

Shane Rosenthal, the producer of the White Horse Inn, was on with Todd Wilken on Monday to talk about the change of Schullers over at the Crystal Cathedral. Here's the link. http://www.issuesetc.org/podcast/Show86102708H2S1.mp3

Scott Clark, from Westminster Seminary California, was also on "Issues" (Wednesday) to talk about the Emerging Church movement. http://www.issuesetc.org/podcast/Show87102808H2S2.mp3

Comments

[Felix]

Im hooked, they play Van Halen on their ads.

[Mike]

I have an honest question regarding Lutheranism, specifically their view of baptismal regeneration and how it is possible to embrace it and sola fide. I know they dont teach ex opera operato as RC does. However as one who has earnestly desired to join the LCMS this is my one stumblingblock. Kim without setting you at odds with your Lutheran friends(which I consider them too) or seeking to pick a fight by bringing this up. I know they say the recipient, even the infant repents and believes, but with so many instances of baptism being adminstered post fide(iam not arguing against paedo baptism either even though I find it stretching to say all infants who are baptised as children of Lutherans have believed and repented. Thoughts anyone. I myself find justification by faith alone diametrically opposed to adding anything(even if you say the baptism is God work not ours. But I feel I must be misunderstanding something as many great men of faith hold to that position. Thoughts anyone. Your help is appreciated-even if I become LCMS.

[Felix]

Im kinda new to the reformed faith, could u guys post the link for the W.H.I. show when they interviewed Schuller?

Tks

[John Yeazel]

Mike,

Lloyd is the best one to ask about Lutheran doctrinal matters. There is a good web site that Lloyd has referred me to on occasion (www.WELS.net) that explains Wisconsin Synod doctrinal matters with tons of scripture references. In regards to baptism the Missouri Synod and Wisconsin Synod believe the same things. I would give you Lloyd's email address but I do not feel free to do so in a public forum. He comes on this site all the time- he is well versed in the scriptures, a great guy and knows Lutheran doctrine very well.

[Kim Riddlebarger]

Felix:

This is from the White Horse Inn's producer, Shane Rosenthal.

We don't have the audio of that available on our site, but you can point him to highlights from the interview (text version) here:

http://www.whitehorseinn.org/schuller.htm

[John Yeazel]

Scott Clark's synopsis of the emerging movement is clear, concise and caused me to have one of those moments of clarity- you know when all of the sudden you just get it. Anyone who has been following the emergent movement for the last three years needs to listen to it. I have been arguing with some emergents, willow creekers and someone I call an independent maverick on Chris Rosenbrough's web site extreme theology for the last week and after listening to Scott Clark all this stuff just came together.

Arguing with these guys on the internet is good practice in helping you to clarify what you believe and why you believe it. You also have to develop extreme patience when dealing with them. I almost began to lose it with this independent maverick guy but I pulled back because I do not think he was quite ready yet. He is quite the feisty one. He gave it back to me just as hard as I was giving it to him- kind of like Zrim does.

[Lloyd]

Hi John:

Thanks for the kind words.

You can feel free to give Mike my email address. I'll do the best I can to answer his questions, or I will get him the answers that he needs from my pastor.

You are right, our theology is extremely close to the LCMS. One of the major differences from us and the LCMS, is that we are unified in doctrine.

In the LCMS, only the pastors are the called workers. With us, it is the pastors, administrators, elders, teachers and the synod, are all called workers, or "church."

Also, I believe that our WELS website is the best regarding any conceivable questions on Lutheranism, the Bible or just about any theological questions one might have. It is updated every day.

[Lloyd]

Hi Mike:

Lutherans never claim that every baby that is baptized is saved. (That would be "irresistible grace", which we do not hold to.) Also, that would make baptism a magic formula, where everyone that gets baptized is saved. That is going farther than what the Scriptures teach.

What percentage of people are saved in baptism? We don't know. We only teach (and the Scriptures teach), that God uses baptism as a means to create and sustain faith, and He washes away sins in it as well.

Luther has a bunch of great stuff in his writings on baptism. The great thing about Luther, is that if you could show him from the Scriptures where he was wrong, he would change his position, rather than to persist in error, because of pride.

I find it most gratifiying, that when I demonstrate from the Scriptures, that God does use baptism as a means for salvation, how many dispensationalist's say, "wow, the Bible does really teach it." It is so easy to do, when you have Scriptural support for your position.