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"Amillennialism 101" -- Audio and On-Line Resources
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Who Said That?

"This then, is a plain proof that the doctrine of predestination is not a doctrine of God, because it makes void the ordinance of God; and God is not divided against himself.

[The doctrine of Predestination] directly tends to destroy that holiness which is the end of all the ordinances of God.  I do not say, none who hold it are holy; (for God is of tender mercy to those who are unavoidably entangled in errors of any kind;) but that the doctrine itself, -- that every man is either elected or not elected from eternity, and that the one must inevitably be saved, and the other inevitably damned, -- has a manifest tendency to destroy holiness in general; for it wholly takes away those first motives to follow after it, so frequently proposed in Scripture, the hope of future reward and fear of punishment, the hope of heaven and fear of hell."

OK, who said that?  Leave your guess in  the comments section below.  No google searches  or cheating!

Reader Comments (41)

John Wesley?
August 11, 2008 | Unregistered CommenterMark Priestap
Hmmm. The language (even more strongly, the punctuation) makes me think of a Victorian. The content's focus is "holiness", which is certainly not improper when expressed correctly, but the terms used make it sound as though the author believes that it is our own holiness which wins for us heaven.

I was going to say Wesley on a bad day or Finney on a good one, but on reflection, I'll simply guess at Finney.
August 11, 2008 | Unregistered CommenterPhilip Walker
August 11, 2008 | Unregistered CommenteraL
Charles G. Finney
August 11, 2008 | Unregistered Commenterdsanger
August 11, 2008 | Unregistered CommenterJB
Isaac Watts?
August 11, 2008 | Unregistered CommenterCoyle
John Wesley?
August 11, 2008 | Unregistered CommenterGreg
I think Mark got it...John Wesley.
August 11, 2008 | Unregistered CommenterStephen
I don't know if Finney would be so nice about it...

August 11, 2008 | Unregistered CommenterJosh
I will go with a modern day person. Giesler or Hunt.
August 11, 2008 | Unregistered CommenterKyleinWI
I'll go Wesley. The Bible clearly teaches predistination of the elect before the foundation of the world. It doesn't, however, teach predestination to damnation. Luther, wisely let the paradox stand.
August 11, 2008 | Unregistered CommenterLloyd
I'm a firm believer in election. Contrastly, those at the Wesleyan church I (unfortunately) attend, are not believers in this biblical teaching. Is there a good resource for defending the position of election-specifically a book or something written expressly for this Wesleyan belief?
August 11, 2008 | Unregistered CommenterMatt
Sorry, for this non-Wesleyan belief.
August 11, 2008 | Unregistered CommenterMatt
Hi Matt:

The Book of Concord gives the most Biblical treatment of election.
August 11, 2008 | Unregistered CommenterLloyd
Some of the comments above about "election" leave me a little confused. Election and predestination are referred to directly in the epistles and indirectly by Jesus, himself. Therefore, all Christians should subscribe to these concepts.

What does differ among various Christian denominations, however, the KIND of election and to WHAT is one predestined. From reading this blog and other religious material, I get the impression that the Reformed belief (Calvinistic) is a dual predestination where one is elected from before eternity by an omniscient God either to salvation or to damnation. Beliefs at the Armenian belief seems to be more vague and evasive about whether or not one is even predestined at all and that anyone can move ones self into a state of salvation by doing the right things and believing the right things.

Stuck in the middle are the Lutherans, who certainly subscribe to the concepts of election and predestination, but only that God has chosen some for salvation, not for damnation. It is a paradox. Reformed insist on solving the paradox by using "either/or" logic; Evangelicals ignore the paradox; and Lutherans accept the paradox as a mysterious concept that can only be understood by God, not by humans.

To that end, the above quote almost sounds like something from Luther, except for all of the rhetoric about "holiness."
August 11, 2008 | Unregistered CommenterGeorge
Another miss-guided Arminian. One would think predestination wasn't mentioned by name in the bible? yet it is, and they still don't believe it....
August 11, 2008 | Unregistered Commenterjason
John Wesley
August 11, 2008 | Unregistered CommenterCharles S
John R. Rice (from his book; Predestined Hell?)
August 11, 2008 | Unregistered CommenterDan
Charles Finney?
August 11, 2008 | Unregistered CommenterMatt D

Even after you mentioned it during the second service a few months ago, I am still astounded.
August 11, 2008 | Unregistered CommenterNicholas Coleman

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